With this same process, if churches can be considered tax-exempt then so can this University. However, if they are going to hold to their mission and not recognize this student organization due to its expressed opinions, then I do not feel it should receive ANY federal funding (that includes any grants or scholarships that are used by students to attend).

By utilizing their “religious mission” they have voided the clear separation of church and state and thus have forfeited any rights to receive federal funding.

A church can have tax exempt status as a church, and tax exempt organizations can be formed to advocate many things, good and bad. It depends upon wheather they drop bombs on us or we drop bombs on them as to whom is viewed an the bad guys. Notice their heros are our enemies… (note also it is seldom “us” that does wrong, it is usually “them” who have it wrong, in any group…) …. Since these acts do make the institution appear to be church with a “my way or the highway” attitude, it may be more honest to give up its tax exempt status as a University and reorganize under a tax exempt status as a church, or even more honest, if they advocate government laws to limit behaviors to only what they believe is “right,” call it a political organization…

Prof Boze (not the spray-paint one)
Profesor of Accountancy
University of Alaska Anchorage

“Pro-life” people, start protesting and teaching against the death penalty, starvation-causing corporate greed and stupid, needless, greedy wars. Put your money where your mouth is.

“Pro-life” people, start protesting the death penalty and stupid, needless, greedy wars. Put your money where your mouth is.

“Didn’t say that the University was stripped of its rights — only that there are those who wish to do so (which is obvious, so don’t deny it).”

What right do some people obviously want to repeal that Liberty somehow now possesses at this moment? Liberty DOES NOT have the right to accept federal money and still discriminate based on political ideology in the disbursement of those funds. Categorically, they DO NOT, and never have had that right.

“By the way, why should an institution of learning pay taxes?”

Because a private school is essentially a business. People and business entities pay taxes in this and every other country on Earth. Get used to it. It won’t change anytime soon.

“Maybe the business of tax exemption is just a tool of the government (force) to control free speech.”

What a foolish and ignorant thing to say. If anything it is the exact opposite. Liberty has a choice, they choose to accept federal tax money, and therefore they have willingly bought into the rules of that game. Period. They have always had a choice, and they still do, though in a few months/years time that choice may be made for them by a court of law.

“You cannot have free speech unless people are free to speak and organize freely.”

A more circuitous and unnecessary statement there never was.

“Freedom is not an entitlement.”

And neither are federal funds to support your business. Listen, Liberty has essentially made a contract with the US govt. that along with federal monies they agree to abide by certain rules of fairness. Liberty is in violation of that contract, which they willingly entered into. If you enter into a contract with someone, you have to honor it. If you accept money from a bank, you are bound by certain legal obligations too, just like Liberty U.

“All they have to do is open their mouths and speak/pick up a pen/write an e-mail, etc.”

Same with Liberty U. You’re holding the two parties to completely different standards here. The money that Liberty U is withholding from the LUCD is not really theirs to “exercise their free speech rights” with. Which is the same reason that when congress passed the laws banning stem cell research, universities had to alter their allocation of funds so that only private funds from tuition, donors, etc could be used to fund that research, and no federal dollars. The reason is that federal monies come with different “strings” attached. It’s not their to simply do as they please with.

The students are free to discuss and share. That is a God-given right. This right does not require “special support”. All they have to do is open their mouths and speak/pick up a pen/write an e-mail, etc.,… Yes, it sometimes takes courage, but foolhardiness will often suffice. They can also find financial support at another school, if they wish. Why would you want to force the University to give up money to those spouting oppositional stuff? The (private) University has the right to ask that its student body has similar sentiments to its own. I think they are within their rights to expel these students (who maybe belong in another tribe).

P.S. “Absent this freedom, “… How can you be absent something that is inalienable? You can be oppressed (as in in fear for your life), or not, but not absent. Freedom is not an entitlement.

“For those of you who think that the University should be stripped of its rights”

This has nothing to do with the universities rights. They accept federal funding, and as such are beholden to certain policies regarding how that money is used. If they want free reign then they cannot accept federal funding. Liberty wants to have its cake and eat it too. That’s just unpossible.

For all those who are acting out of love (all races, genders, persuasions,…) hold fast, and pray for the violent ones (which is almost all of us at one time or another). Best.

Good for you, you have an opinion. Too bad that isn’t the point of this issue.

If it is a religious institution, let it stick to religion.

Liberty University is taking a political stand, supporting one view while silencing another. This is “un-american”. Once they take a political stand, they should loose their tax-free status. This is true for all institutions including churches. Enter the political ring and loose your non-profit status.

Gee, maybe if the catholic church lost it’s tax-free status it would no longer be able to pay all of the defense fees for pedophile priests.

The previous post should read “By the way, one can put whatever they like in the LUCD charter…whether or not they (members) actually abide by that statement (the charter) is another matter.

itsalljustaride:

I found this

http://www.liberty.edu/index.cfm?PID=18495&MID=8375

on Liberty’s website. If the article linked above is correct, there has been a fair amount of misrepresentation in the media.

Given what you have pointed out about LUDC’s charter and provided thier actions follow said charter, I would be in perfect agreement with you that the LUDC should not have been given the boot.

itsaljustaride, I sincerely wish you the best and sorry for getting carried away with the monkey statements.

I would hope all parties involved would remeber that civility in a debate about important public matters only lends credibility to one’s arguments. And likewise, insults, pejorative language, scape-goating, and fallacious reasoning damage that same credibiltiy.

“When a university decided to oust a club for supporting abortion rights and same-sex marriage, it didn’t expect to face trouble from this unlikely source.”

If what you say is true, then this article is very misleading, yes?

My hypotheticals have direct application here because at this point, we have no facts regarding the status of other Democratic clubs at Liberty. If the club, true to its LUCD, actively supported an anti-abortion agenda but was disbanded anyway (simply because of thier ties with the Democratic Party), then I can see and agree with your point. However, based on the information in this article, one can only conclude the club did not in fact hold true to thier LUCD.

By the way, one can put whatever they like in the LUCD…whether or not they actually abide by that statement is another matter.

“maybe everyone could have a reasoned debate”

With a person like you in that debate, who seems intent on inserting “monkey” and “liberal” into every other sentence, I don’t see that happening. Your outright contempt for some of your students is not a healthy attitude for an educator to have. I’m not going to try to impress you with my academic career, because it makes no difference, and is, like much you love to bring up, irrelevant to this issue at hand. You take far too much license to generalize and make assumptions about people whom you know only through a few typed words.

Al Gore has nothing to do with this.

Your chemistry students and their religious persuasions have nothing to do with this.

My educational background has nothing to do with this.

“They simple said that they will not support a club who actively promotes ideals contrary to Liberty’s mission.”

Again, read the LUCD statement. The LUCD had explicitly included a statement in their charter that said they are anti-abortion and support traditional marriage, at the request of Liberty U, who approved them. Now Liberty is taking it back and making it look like the students are at fault.