Comments on: Dorm search yields bonanza – but was it legal? http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong Fri, 03 Feb 2012 02:37:59 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3 By: ChamberDoc http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-6050 ChamberDoc Mon, 08 Feb 2010 14:32:56 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-6050 "Room search by RA, no search warrant needed." Under what rule of law does that appear? An RA cannot waive someone's 4th Amendment rights, just like your landlord cannot grant permission for the police to search your house. In the case at point, both occupants gave written consent to search. This is an important point, because if one of them hadn't, then the other tenant's private property/space would have been excluded from the legal search area. “Room search by RA, no search warrant needed.”

Under what rule of law does that appear? An RA cannot waive someone’s 4th Amendment rights, just like your landlord cannot grant permission for the police to search your house. In the case at point, both occupants gave written consent to search. This is an important point, because if one of them hadn’t, then the other tenant’s private property/space would have been excluded from the legal search area.

]]> By: Proginoskes http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5958 Proginoskes Fri, 05 Feb 2010 21:12:33 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5958 Pineshadow Said: "If the student didn’t consent to the search, and if the officer didn’t have a search warrant, then I agree with the court that this was unreasonable search and seizure." Did you even READ the article? My guess is no, because otherwise you'd know that they did consent. (They signed forms allowing it.) If the police hadn't had those forms, they wouldn't have been able to search. If the students weren't stupid, they would have refused to sign the papers. Pineshadow Said: “If the student didn’t consent to the search, and if the officer didn’t have a search warrant, then I agree with the court that this was unreasonable search and seizure.”

Did you even READ the article? My guess is no, because otherwise you’d know that they did consent. (They signed forms allowing it.)

If the police hadn’t had those forms, they wouldn’t have been able to search.

If the students weren’t stupid, they would have refused to sign the papers.

]]> By: Ed http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5954 Ed Fri, 05 Feb 2010 20:53:08 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5954 Police should have sought out residence hall staff, an RA, who like any college official may enter a residence hall room. RA knocks, identifies himself, and directs that room door be opened. If student does not enter, RA keys in to room, questions the resident about report, while police do a visually scan of the room and respond to any illegal item in plain view. Room seach by police, when resident does not give consent, means warrant is needed. Room search by RA, no search warrant needed. Police should have sought out residence hall staff, an RA, who like any college official may enter a residence hall room. RA knocks, identifies himself, and directs that room door be opened. If student does not enter, RA keys in to room, questions the resident about report, while police do a visually scan of the room and respond to any illegal item in plain view. Room seach by police, when resident does not give consent, means warrant is needed. Room search by RA, no search warrant needed.

]]> By: Michael http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5945 Michael Fri, 05 Feb 2010 18:36:31 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5945 Not enough information. When I lived in a dorm, the school (read "campus police") had the right to enter at any time -- signing away our 4th Amendment right was a requirement of living on campus. I'd need to know more about this specific school's policies before weighing in. (Also, did the search happen minutes after the guy was "waving a knife around" or days later -- this makes a difference. Brandishing a knife is a felony in some areas, and police could enter to perform an arrest.) Not enough information. When I lived in a dorm, the school (read “campus police”) had the right to enter at any time — signing away our 4th Amendment right was a requirement of living on campus. I’d need to know more about this specific school’s policies before weighing in.

(Also, did the search happen minutes after the guy was “waving a knife around” or days later — this makes a difference. Brandishing a knife is a felony in some areas, and police could enter to perform an arrest.)

]]> By: ChamberDoc http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5931 ChamberDoc Fri, 05 Feb 2010 16:27:06 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5931 "The police acted on credible information and the students signed the consent. They got caught and deserve their punishment. So why are we trying to blame the police?" Because that's how lawyers make their living. When in doubt, the police are to blame. Never mind that the students may have been committing felonies, the police didn't say "pretty please" etc. The object of the exercise is to assign blame. Since they can't possibly admit that the students were wrong, then it must have been the police who screwed up. “The police acted on credible information and the students signed the consent. They got caught and deserve their punishment. So why are we trying to blame the police?”

Because that’s how lawyers make their living. When in doubt, the police are to blame. Never mind that the students may have been committing felonies, the police didn’t say “pretty please” etc. The object of the exercise is to assign blame. Since they can’t possibly admit that the students were wrong, then it must have been the police who screwed up.

]]> By: Swifty http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5927 Swifty Fri, 05 Feb 2010 16:00:19 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5927 I suppose if the police had not been proactive, and Carr proceeded to go "Columbine" then the police would have been blamed for not being proactive. You just can't seem to win when attempting to enforce the law. I suppose if the police had not been proactive, and Carr proceeded to go “Columbine” then the police would have been blamed for not being proactive. You just can’t seem to win when attempting to enforce the law.

]]> By: Rick http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5923 Rick Fri, 05 Feb 2010 15:16:07 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5923 The thing that bothers me about these cases is that the questions are all about if the police actions were legal and we seem to overlook that the actions of the students were *not* legal. The police acted on credible information and the students signed the consent. They got caught and deserve their punishment. So why are we trying to blame the police? The thing that bothers me about these cases is that the questions are all about if the police actions were legal and we seem to overlook that the actions of the students were *not* legal.

The police acted on credible information and the students signed the consent. They got caught and deserve their punishment. So why are we trying to blame the police?

]]> By: ChamberDoc http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5916 ChamberDoc Fri, 05 Feb 2010 14:17:36 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5916 As the article says, both students signed consent forms. If they hadn't, the search would have been illegal. Since they did, anything found was fair game. They didn't have to consent and they could have withdrawn that consent at any time. Their wounds are self-inflicted. As the article says, both students signed consent forms. If they hadn’t, the search would have been illegal. Since they did, anything found was fair game. They didn’t have to consent and they could have withdrawn that consent at any time. Their wounds are self-inflicted.

]]> By: Pineshadow http://www.higheredmorning.com/student-had-drugs-and-gun-%e2%80%93-but-cops-were-in-the-wrong/comment-page-1#comment-5841 Pineshadow Wed, 03 Feb 2010 21:37:57 +0000 http://www.higheredmorning.com/?p=3655#comment-5841 If the student didn't consent to the search, and if the officer didn't have a search warrant, then I agree with the court that this was unreasonable search and seizure. If the student didn’t consent to the search, and if the officer didn’t have a search warrant, then I agree with the
court that this was unreasonable search and seizure.

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